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Lets say i play a condi Mesmer/mirage: Condition stat would be my first choice, obviously, followed by either Precision (need it mainly for Bleed proc) or/and Expertise. Then there is an option to take Power or Vitality or Toughness. I would usually take offensive stat over defensive one, IF the offensive stat would be on pair with the defensive one. What do i mean with 'be on pair'. Lets say i can choose between 900 Vitality or 900 Power. 900 Vitality increases my health for roughly 60%! That's a lot. I wouldn't expect that 900 Power would add 60% to my dps lol. But i would expect at least 20% higher dps (combined with precision), otherwise i would rather go for defensive stat. Is there a way to test what's the difference between having zero or 900 Power as condi Mesmer? I have been told by guild mate that the difference is only about 5 - 7%. If this is true, is it ok, if i ignore Power completely?
Healing Condi Dmg Gw 2 Attribute Chart
Attribute combinations are the sets of attributes that can be found in equipment and upgrade components across the game. They are commonly referred to as prefixes in equipment pieces, and suffixes in upgrade components. All combinations have at least one designated major attribute, and up to two minor attributes. May 20, 2018 This video showcases the Revenant and all of its Elite specializations for both expansions. Subscribe for more videos! Feb 14, 2020 Hello Everyone! Royal is back! This is a new start in my gaming life and hopefully I see you guys in game More PvP Montages and Guides will be coming soon, stay tuned! (I really got to learn. The common Condi Druid builds are all A/T + SB like the meta Condi Ranger DPS setups. This means that if things get ugly for the group, you have 15s of Celestial Avatar, and then you're pretty much done healing until you get enough Life Force again.
There are other condi builds which prefers Power over Precision: condi Thief and Guardian. The same question here: is it ok if i take Vitality/Toughnes over Precision?
If i play any Power spec, i am almost forced to take all three dps stats: power, precision and ferocity. Sure, i can add some vitality on top of that (Marauder stats or something similar) but i am not sure how important are non condi dps stats for condi builds ...
Comments
In PvE generally defensive stats are not needed. So it is usually sinister stats, viper or grievers. All have power.
- edited October 29, 2017
You do not need any Power for Condi build. Having extra HP is much nicer since it allows you to get hit few times without instantly going down, or survive few condis on you even when condi removal is on cooldown.
I play Condi Scourge in WvW and have full Trailblazer (Toughness + Vit + Condi + Exp).
Thanks, but i want to know what is the dmg loss, if you skip Power? More then 15% of your dps?
One of my tests on the training golem showed that the total contribution of power damage on my condi mirage's total damage of 29544, was 8831. I'm not exactly the best at keeping rotations so it could be higher. If you're interested, here's my report card
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- edited October 29, 2017
@Sephylon.4938 said:
One of my tests on the training golem showed that the total contribution of power damage on my condi mirage's total damage of 29544, was 8831. I'm not exactly the best at keeping rotations so it could be higher. If you're interested, here's my report cardI assume this is with gear that has condi/power/precision(/else).
It's important to note that you'd still get some of that 8831 damage even if you had no power on your gear. I'd say, as a ballpark estimate, power and precision on condi gear that have both accounts for anywhere from 10-15% of your total dps, judging purely from your numbers there. Of course. I imagine this will vary wildly from class to class, and even build to build.
yes, I forgot to mention that. My apologies. I was using full viper gear with no food.
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Also just noticed it doesn't show my buffs. Anyway, I was using the usual: 25 might, fury, quickness, alac, 5 gotl, sun+frost, spotter, strength and disci banner with empower and engi buff.
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- edited October 29, 2017
What game mode?
It's not so much that power is 'needed', it depends what you're building for and what you want to be able to do.
For example I like hybrid with power so I can make use of a bit of burst damage and a bit of sustained damage (I don't like 100-0 glass cannon as much as I don't like pure attrition bunker) so I am more difficult to counter - I don't get hardcountered by resistance spam or protection spam or whatever, and I also have more flexible choice of skills/weapons/traits and can change things around without needing to regear.
0 @otto.5684 said:
In PvE generally defensive stats are not needed. So it is usually sinister stats, viper or grievers. All have power.A bit of toughness and vitality will help a lot when you're going to take on champions and legendaries in PvE. Especially for squishies like us. Sure, you will los some DPS in comparison to zerkers, but when you lie dead on the ground you won't do very much damage either.
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Besides you will need some power in case you meet enemies that are immune to your conditions or keep stripping them off.
Ascalon Will Prevail!
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Here's the big problem. Mathematically speaking, each skill has a different power efficient (how much of your power stat is used when calculating damage). Power coefficients vary radically so there's not a flat 'if you lose [x] amount of power you lose [x] amount of damage'. Something like a Mesmer Sword has high Power coefficients so losing out on Power drops your damage by a more noticeable amount vs a weapon like Scepter or Axe that have lower power coefficients but compensate that by applying conditions.
For PvE. the way you generally want to look at things is in the following order:
- +100% condi duration on your primary condition(s). E.G. +100% burning for Guard makes sense but +100% Confusion does not.
- Condition Damage. Pretty self explanatory here.
- Precision: A lot of traits apply skills based on critical strikes
- Power: Since most of your condi weapons have bad power scaling this is generally the stat that you look at last. Again, varies per class and even further by class weapon
- Ferocity: Same as above, your physical damage is pretty bad in most cases so no need to increase it.
The best way to figure out where your damage is coming from is to smack a golem. (ArcDPS have a damage breakdown by skill/condition). From there you can see how much your damage falls off by taking more defensive gear.
Again, this is all pretty generalized as we can't give you a definitive answer without having tested this ourselves or guesstimating by modifying data collected from others.
You don't need power assuming you never plan on touching any core content because there are various bits of stuff in core content that is just completely immune to conditions and crits. You would still be able to kill/destroy those but it would be extremely slow.
In the case of guardian you also have the issue of destroyers and various fire elementals that are also immune to burning.
@Sifu.9745 said:
Thanks, but i want to know what is the dmg loss, if you skip Power? More then 15% of your dps?It depends heavily on the class, and amount of damage bias the skills have. Hybrid classes like Engineer benefit from both, but most condi builds for Engineer ignore the power component due to poor scaling. Ranger is also a hybrid class, also has power scaling on its condi build, but scales much better then Engineer on Condi due to its skills having longer base duration.
But then you have a build like Firebrand, which only uses Fire (which scales incredibly well), doesn't need Expertise (can get 100% burn duration on via traits and runes), and whose weapons all have a strong power component. Because of this, Grieving stat can fully utilize all aspects of both power and condi damage, and focus all aspect into its damage. While the power component is less significant compared to the burn damage, its still additional DPS for literally zero trade off compared to something like sinisters.
What should i go for: Carrion, Deadshot, Rabid, Wanderer, Rampager or Celestial maybe? for condi Mesmer open world, WvW and PvP? I am not interested to raid/fractal with my condi Mesmer (Mirage next week) so this question is only about stats for core Mesmer and Mirage condition stats for solo playing (well, if you don't mind i would take your advice about raids/fractals stats as well ). I have no problem with choosing Traits, i just can't decide which stats suits condi mesmer playstyle the best ... Power vs crit, or the mixture of both, that's the question ...
It looks like that scepter supports precision over power, while Axe is more power oriented weapon ...
Sorry for English ...
Comments
Sinister for quick burst (higher output than Viper until 6s after ramped).
Viper for sustained dps (higher output than Sinister 6s after fully ramped).
Trailblazer for tanky dps (see: WvW).
Deadshot for tanky bursty dps (higher output than Trailblazer, squishier).Don't go Celestial (this is just bad), Rabid (see trailblazer), Carrion (see rabid), Rampager (see sinister), or Wanderer (why do you want Power, Toughness, Vitality, Concentration again?).
Usually you opt for crit over power on condi builds due to Sharper Images. This is the main reason why Deadshot does more damage than Trailblazer (other than your attacks occasionally critting for tiny bonus damage).
For Raids/Fractals (where you're rarely going to be taken as a Condi Mesmer), you aim for 100% Condi Duration with full Viper. This may use some Sinister pieces in the future due to Dune Cloak if you opt for Mirage. Axe will have more Condi damage output than Scepter but lowers your overall DPS in Raids due to the clone spawn on Axe2 (which is the only reason it outperforms Scepter).
Viper's (Power, Condition Damage, Precision, Expertise) is probably the best, and is more accessible than Sinister. However, if you don't have the relevant crafting disciplines, then go for Rampager's instead.
Condition Damage without Condition Duration is not ideal, and while you may not feel the difference for shorter fights, encounters with Veterans or Elites will start to drag on. Unlike other classes, Mesmer and Mirage rely on multiple Condition types for damage, including Torment, Bleed, Confusion, and Burning. This means that we can't skimp on Expertise like Guardians and Firebrands.
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Thanks, guys. I am not sure about Viper and Sinister, since i don't feel 'comfortable' enough without one defensive stat. For solo pve, WvW and PvP i would rather have 5k more health or 500 or even 900 toughness, instead of 3 or 4 dps only stats. If i drop 1050 Power for 900 Toughness or 500 Vitality i guess my dmg/dps would only drop for about 5% - 10%, while my survivability will get increased for about 25% - 35%.
Anyway Viper and Sinister are both account bound, can't buy them on TP. I don't want to spend 6 + months crafting just to get all exotic Viper and/or Sinister gear. I only buy Exotics from TP and Ascended trinkets for Laurels. So i can only afford myself gear with 3 stats + ascended trinkets for now.Condi dmg and toughness. As the devs added on the mirage runes. ;_;
Kidding. It is a subect to change in the exoac launch but right now morage could prob work really well with co di based sets at least in ove so vipers and sinister.
I am currently running a viper chrono with torment runes and torment sigil on scepter. But to be honest I would wait with equipping a new mesmer until PoF launched. As far as I know there will be new stat combinations coming out too.
I am also curious about this - IMHO it will have to be some kind of mix between viper and sinister.
Reasoning: full viper would have too low crit chance to reliably proc Sharper Images while full sinister would have too low a of condi duration.
I will probably start with full viper armor set (reasonably cheap to convert my ascended zoja set) + sinister jewellery (full set sitting in bank for a long time - was reward for some old LS chapters?)@Ryouzanpaku.1273 said:
I am also curious about this - IMHO it will have to be some kind of mix between viper and sinister.
Reasoning: full viper would have too low crit chance to reliably proc Sharper Images while full sinister would have too low a of condi duration.
I will probably start with full viper armor set (reasonably cheap to convert my ascended zoja set) + sinister jewellery (full set sitting in bank for a long time - was reward for some old LS chapters?)It depends on the game mode. In Raids, running full Viper is still better than Sinister. You end up at ~70% crit chance, which drops your average bleed stacks per Duelist by 2.4 but by having double condi duration, you more than make up for it. The thing is, pushing your crit past 50% has diminishing returns and full Viper sits at 30% (before raid buffs).
As for getting Sinister jewelry, that's an expensive way of doing it. You can get cheap ascended accessories of every (non PoF) stat combination from LS3. Bitterfrost Frontier and Siren's Landing both offer easy access to farming their map currencies.
- edited September 18, 2017
I just went full Trailblazers with Torment runes. Super tanky, ~21k health, and condition damage with duration (100% Confusion and Torment, ~75% everything else).
This should carry over into PoF and it is great in WvW.
Another stat combination you can look into is Dire, which is Condition Damage, Vitality, and Toughness.
- edited September 18, 2017
@Esplen.3940 said:
It depends on the game mode. In Raids, running full Viper is still better than Sinister. You end up at ~70% crit chance, which drops your average bleed stacks per Duelist by 2.4 but by having double condi duration, you more than make up for it. The thing is, pushing your crit past 50% has diminishing returns and full Viper sits at 30% (before raid buffs).As for getting Sinister jewelry, that's an expensive way of doing it. You can get cheap ascended accessories of every (non PoF) stat combination from LS3. Bitterfrost Frontier and Siren's Landing both offer easy access to farming their map currencies.
I suppose raid is like this - but I do not care about raids so it is not my case - I am looking for reasonable self provided crit chance.
I am aware of LS3 maps (and have saved 1000+ of most currencies just to be sure but as I already have full sinister set of jewellery (for probably more then 2 years) I cannot see how is it expensive for me
@Ryouzanpaku.1273 said:
I am aware of LS3 maps (and have saved 1000+ of most currencies just to be sure but as I already have full sinister set of jewellery (for probably more then 2 years) I cannot see how is it expensive for meWell, considering it's not possible to stat swap accessories (unless they're Bloodstone Fen accessories), then you're SoL.
Well I can always let sinister jewellery rot in bank and buy LS3 accessories.... does not really matter TBH as it is dirty cheap anyway.
What I wanted to say - IMHO best condi equip for Mirage will be some combination of viper & sinister and I will start to test it with the equip I have already available.
So when I was in the testing, I had placed some sinister ascended trinkets in my bank and perplexity runes and sigils I needed for the current build I run to test in Beta.
This is the build I've been running for months, transitioning from full Sinister to now Half Vipers Half Sinisters. I personally love the build and it's easy for me to master especially with have barely any toughness. I study a lot of the other classes and adapt pretty easy when out in PvP or WvW (mostly) so I 'm capable of holding my own even against 'meta' builds.The above build I use in PvE, Dungeons and Fractals as well, but obviously change certain utilities depending on the situation. Now what I tested for the Mirage and what i'll be running because it works for ME. Again, build what you're comfortable with (i'm all for build positivity). This Mirage build i'll mainly be using in WvW as I shut down a lot of players with it from my personal experience - a hyper confusion build of sorts. For PvE i'll be using this build as well but switching utilities when needed and also weaving between keeping clones up and shattering with only cry of frustration.
Enjoy! Hope to see some of you fellow members in PoF! Xoxo
- edited September 18, 2017
I've been supplementing Viper weapons/armour with cele trinkets for solo/smallscale play in wvw with chrono and it has been great over the last year and a half.
Going to keep the same trend of cele trinkets because of the might stacking potential of mirage using staff, DE, dodge food, IH and things like BD or SS.
A bit of cele rounds off viper nicely by making you not totally glass - ie pushing up to 20k health and just under 2.4k armour, with some healing power to help the new regen on cloak and adding to power/prec/condi/fero.
It should be easy to maintain at least a few stacks of might at all times which pushes power well over 2k and condi damage up to around 1.3k if not more with perma vigour (CI, BD, extra vigour on shatter and high boon uptime). My build's in the PoF build thread.
0 depending on if we get a good trait in Mirrage Mantle (Healing or Barrier), I will go with this for WvW (ofc swap Sands of Glass to Mirage Mantle then) : http://de.gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQRAnf8anELDFMjFpBmpBMMjlXDDNAkTeOlVgeTwxv/FATgA-jVSHAB6quDc6HE4JAsoKB1pEEgTAQI7PM/BBoJlfrDOAGrYFrYBjN2YjN2YNgYjN2YjN2YjN2YlCoKlVA-w
Overall good defensive Stats, enough Crit, Nice Dmg with power and Condi Damage. Condi duration isn't needed for WvW in Mirrage's case. Only things u would want to push is torment and bleeding for axe Auto. This + (6) bonus make Krait runes a nice option in my opinion. Condi bomb Jaunts inc. ( i know its no BOMB , hell get over it ^^)
0I have dire stats because I'm poor. But I plan on upgrading them to trailblazer peu en peu. It is in order to get a bit tankier build. Atm I'm running runes of antitoxin, but might change to either perplexity (if they ever sell recipe at pact vendors) or the new mirage runes
How are the new versions of the runes of perplexity? I have a full set that I was going to swap over to my Mirage, but I can decide what to swap her armor to. I am going to be running essentially pvp, so it's not that important, but if you're running condi at all, you should probably not be wearing Zojja's.
grieving stats coming with pof, power condi high, precision ferocity low. im swapping to that :>